Today's culture - compared to the old days....

[spike99]

I seen a short documentary the other day that really caught my ears.

It was about the comparison on older age culture against today's younger age culture.

Their theme was about "older age was about building / producing" things in life...

And, today's younger age is about "consuming / using cheap - throw away items...".

After looking around with my own eyes, their theme tends to be true (on average).

The younger age generation don't want to manually build houses, build shops or build things with their own hands.

They want instant results, they want to buy cheap and they tend to want very expensive looking items - like gas hog SUVs and flashy looking things. And, they want cell phone at 8-10 years old. It's about doing as little as possible and expecting flashing looking instant rewards.

Funny how our culture has changed over the years....

[joany]

I'm not holding my breath, but I expect that that which was once old will become new again.  Hey!  I read that 33 1/3 records are coming back because of the younger generation discovery of quality; sounds like there may even be lyrics.

[jim]

So true Spike.

Yep Joany, they are coming back. I miss my old stereo, as the music always sound better on it than the ones they make today.

[gerald]

It is true about them not wanted to build things.   It is now getting difficult to get
supplies for some crafts / hobbies because the demand is disappearing.  Fewer
people are taking up woodworking, carving, sewing etc. 


I do not know what they are doing to occupy their time or keep their minds sharp?

[lavishgail]

I know Gerald, they are all to busy on their computers, phones, and Xboxes, i have a younger generation here and thats all they want to do after they get out of work. I look around my home and all of us arr on our phones, its terrible. But my husband and grown kids do build from stick. In fact my decking and everything going on now is all stick. Im thankful.

[gnott]

I have made much the same observation, but I feel that where many of these “comparisons” fail over-all is not recognizing that it is not a true case of choosing opposites, but more of a total change of context – situations, resources, environment, etc. Kids today (as Gerald hinted) don’t exactly have much choice.

Here is an example from my life for comparison. [Rural, small town, Norman Rockwell America. Grin]
My first car was a ‘46 Plymouth Sports Coupe (inline 8, fluid drive). I was .

It cost $25; $15 down and $10 next payday. My tag was $9 and insurance was $4.50 a month. (But didn’t worry about the latter till fall and had enough saved up.) Cops didn’t stop you because they knew who you were and would eventually pay. It was a darn good car. Never had a major break-down*. Would do 70mph if you were stupid enough to do it.

[* Of course one has to define “major break-down”. One could and did repair anything this side of a blown engine. The body was steel. If you actually managed to get a dent, you just pounded it out.]

Western Auto and junk-yards became best friends. Everything was a trade-out rebuilt and don’t believe I ever paid more than $20 for anything and usually a lot less. Everyone had a general tool box, and what you didn’t have you could borrow – all basic – few special tools were needed. A ton of work was done with a screwdriver and pliers. (ha) Most parts you could get repaired locally at one of the two or three garages that had real mechanics and equipment for a few dollars. Such as re-turn, brakes, starters, replace solenoids, spark plug wires, etc. Most of the work we did ourselves – everyone would gather about. I remember attending “valve jobs” done under a tree with the same atmosphere of a “barn Raising”.

I was able to pay for everything via part-time jobs. I worked every Saturday morning cleaning up the local welding shop. Then it was various odd jobs shoveling grain and coal, baling hay, cleaning out chicken houses, greenhouses, etc. There was always a “Boy Wanted” sign somewhere in town. You took the job if you felt like it, and often always learned something new.
I didn’t worry about a driver’s license since I had been operating farm equipment (and my dad’s race car) from the day my feet could reach the pedals. When you went for your driving test you looked at the book only to get the distances and vocabulary right. It cost $3.
Now look at a kid today living in the same place.

NO reliable car available for less than several thousand. But even if someone gave you one. Taxes and insurance will eat you alive. Most have a job JUST to keep a car going. Anything goes wrong – good luck. Parts cost out the wazhoo. And there are no jobs – they couldn’t get a job in a welding shop even if it was still there OS. As for shoveling coal or grain – OSHA would have a fit. Hay baling uses far few people.
I had terrific teenage years, for little less than $20 a month (mostly less). Even when expand for inflation no teenager could do what I did on that much. There is NO comparison. Kids today do nothing because unless they have a lot more money there is nothing they can do. (Kids today spend more on car insurance OR phones than I did on my first HOUSE???) Oops. Rambling will stop. (Smile)

[barb7330]

You are so right Gnotts...I just turned 80 a week ago...Lost hubby in August of 2015 and he was like you...We would have celebrated 50 years in 2016.

Every car we ever owned he fixed...I can remember he used to buy cars just for the parts on a car we might have been driving. The last car we bought was a 2007 Buick Lucerne and he used to get so ticked off with all the computers as he couldn't fix them. He still did oil changes brake jobs and whatever else he could...My hubby was a Jack of all trades though...Saved us a lot of money over the years.


Yep the kids today don't have a clue and it's so sad. My kids were all born in the 50s and 60s so they are still able to do lots of their own work on cars.

I'm afraid for my grands and greats as I'm afraid of where this world is going.

Well time to get some supper...Hope you all have a great evening.

[gerald]

It was similar in our home.  By the time anything every got to the garbage dump it was worn down to nothing!

I managed quite a few people over the past few years and one really concerning issue was their fear of failure in anything.  I guess with the social media age mistakes get recorded for posterity. 

This was a major issue to deal with because they had to step outside of what they knew to develop innovative solutions, and it was a difficult find to ge them there.   It was difficult to get them to focus on the risk rather than the failure.

[gnott]

That’s interesting. I ran into the same sort of phenomena in the last years of my business. Never had an adequate description. You may be on to something.

I had a system design/contract programming firm. I started out as a programmer in the 80’s. Back then you were literally forced to work with ones and ohs. Had to become intimately aware of the client’s resources, their culture, their business, … . We read constantly. Any book we could get our hands on. Knuth inside and out. Any code we could borrow, peek, or steal. We traded ideas and suggestions. Shared experiences. Blah, blah.
Or course all this time our tools got better, data management more robust, wire more reliable, etc. But still we only used them as starting point.

But beginning after Y2K, the new croup of programmers, come-in, use whatever comes with the box, and leave. They talk games and know a zillion video formats. I doubt if most could even spell Knuth. They pitch products they know and drag out learning anything new. When something goes wrong it is the tool, not enough people, too many people, not enough time, the language, the operating system, the brand of router HA. Anything and everything – BUT finding out what and where the problem lies and fixing it.

Ghod do I sound like a grumpy old man or what?

Ignore me. It's their world being remade in their image, Let them lie in it.

[gerald]

Actually I was in the same business and started in the 80's as well.  I did a lot of managing development groups within IT.  We developed all of the companies systems from scratch so it required out of the box thinking.    It was difficult to find people who could work without a ridgid structure around them.    Developing from scratch gave them competitive advantages so they stuck with it.

I ended up at the Director level but by then it was becoming much more difficult to find people capable of developing from scratch, they no longer had the training nor the mindset.

That world has changed. The new programmers excell at the user interaction and graphics.  Understanding what the machine is doing has become a distant memory for most.  Those that do understand get paid major dollars to consult!

As you say, it is becoming their world and they can create it as they wish. 

I imagine our parent thought the same thing, but; I wonder if they understand what they are missing?

[joany]

gnott, gerald...Interesting - I've also had similar experience from the 80's - starting with writing many assembly language programs.  Today I try to modify the source code of whatever system I'm on, because I'm annoyed by "how you think I should work."  - keeps me busy. 

[skate4life]

hey Barb - Happy Birthday!!!

I'll chime in here but can only compare Nursing from my beginning years to today. My best memory is that after a mother delivered her baby, she was given a complete bed bath and allow to rest undisturbed for several hours. They awoke clean, refreshed and thankful! No one can function without a smart phone and it is actually required for the job! Electronic records are useless for ability to chart how a patient is really doing - it is just a bunch of numbers. There is no nursing 'care.' A bed bath you ask? What is that? Sit with a scared patient? You are on your own. If you don't have a friend or family member to help you, watch out. Nurses still eat their young and older doctors still rule. No one is ever addressed by their proper name - everyone is called by their first name, except the doctor of course. Hospitalists have taken over and your primary care doctor no longer comes to your hospital.

I was watching an episode of This Old House and was amazed that they are starting a mentorship program to help people learn some of the trades. Plus skills that can only be done by hand but have given so much beauty and pleasure to our eyes over the centuries. Are you listening Jim!? Without passing these skills on, the only beauty left will be what nature provides - if the land hasn't been raped for new buildings.

[barb7330]

Thanks Skate for the birthday wishes.....Your right, health care in Canada anyway has certainly gone down hill...Certainly hope I don't ever get sick enough to go to hospital...

[jarca]

this is such an interesting thread & i had written a lot about it & lost it somehow.
so frustrating.
but thanks for all the interesting comments & the thread that i really relate to.
but i guess i was just meant to wish barb a very happy birthday instead
HAPPY BIRTHDAY BARB!!!! ( last week )
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[ozboy]

All the best Barb.....sorry I am late as usual but hope you are doing as well as possible.....xxxxxx

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[spike99]

Yes - times certainly have changed since "the good old days". My 2009 mini-van recently had a Service TPMS error on its dash. Don't know where to focus to find its root cause and/or how to fix it. Into the shop it goes - costing me way too much to fix. modern technology and their costly computer fixes.

In reflecting back.... When I was age 12+, I knew the name of every tool in my dad's shop. Even knew the different welders (arc / mig / tig), how to build utility trailers from scratch, knew to how design / install electrical system and do many other construction tasks as well. I even installed electrical brake systems on trailers from scratch as well. Today, I find the 12+ year old kids don't care about stuff like that. They are more interested in the design of their cell phone display and/or how to make their cell phone buddies laugh. Or, compare the amount of "likes" they get on their Facebook accounts. From my old school ways, I'm very sad to see where the majority of our younger generations attitudes is heading into. Very sad....

[gnott]

Just noticed this addition, and it sure hit home. An embarrassing hit. Smile.

I made my kids help when they were younger – but as noted their heart wasn’t in it. My own kids are older now, have their own homes, and becoming interested in various DIY projects. The results are deplorable. I listened to my father, these guys never heard a word.

 
To me the saddest part is not that they can’t join two pieces of wood – that takes practice – the sad part is they can’t use simple hand tools, or even know what they are or called. NOTHING was started or considered until they had a circular saw, a saw table, a joiner, band sanders, hand sanders, and these (forgot the name, $$$$$) fancy blue corner jigs. Had to have a drill stand and a scroll saw, and …. Well you get the idea.
Hundreds if not thousands of dollars worth of toys – and they still can’t make a square corner, or cut off an end at a 90 degree angle.

I suggested they learn how to work with wood using hand tools, then after they know the basics they use their toys to complete jobs faster. They look at me like I’m from another planet.

[joany]

Now and then, after one too many grieving sessions, I ask myself "Why do people die?"

Maybe it's to limit the years when we keep saying "What $#%$# are they doing?"

[gnott]

One of my favorite quotes:

"Things ain't what they used to be and never was." - Will Rogers

(Stolen from Mark Twain, who likely stole it from someone else.)

In general it backs up what you are saying, and it often causes me to reflect - how much is honest observation and how much is grumpy hate changes old man.

[Wanted to add originally but chickened out. (Smile)]

In my case it is even worse since I hold "women" to blame for most of what has gone wrong over the last 50 years. (Any many place the start back another 50 - but I won't go there. Already started enough trouble as it is. )